Engine dead...

[Allan.Atherton]

Perhaps the bike is OK, but you have not had the bike long enough to ride it much, and are now experiencing your first instance of "flooding". Flooding occurs when the bike does not start in one or two kicks, and continued kicking results in an over-rich mixture. This will prevent the engine from starting until you either clear the mixture, or let the bike sit for an hour or so to let the excess fuel evaporate.

If you think the engine is flooded, you can clear the over-rich mixture by holding the throttle wide open while kicking a few times. Then close the throttle and kick once or twice, and it should start. If not, repeat the procedure.

[Micha]

I thought about it. I cleaned and dried the spark plugs and vented the cylinders with many kicks while fuel cock closed. Unfortunately with no result.

[EuroIron]

if the plugs were found to be wet and fouled

try some new ones

won't hurt to even go a step hotter until you get everything dialed in

just listen for pinging or detonation if you ride it with hotter plugs

this gas today is brutal on spark plugs having low energy ignition systems

and not too easy plugs hooked up to much higher energy systems

as in, I've had more than a few "once fouled" plugs that didn't care to work even after being bead blasted clean again

[Micha]

Thanks for this info.

Even if they both have a good spurk?

[EuroIron]

well yes

but plug jumping a small gap in open air is quite a bit different than jumping a gap under compression

not a bad idea, and quite valid as well, to simulate jumping the gap under compression, by opening the gap quite large, one plug only, and seeing where it quits jumping

this will be a good benchmark for you to have as it indicates the "reserve", at least as correctly as that term can be applied to an energy transfer ignition...

but the amount of energy the magneto is able to deliver to the plugs

it should be able to jump the total of two gaps something around 10mm but certainly total gaps, in open air, at or near the "safety gap"

this would indicate an adequately healthy magneto

of course seeing it having enough spunk to jump the correctly adjusted safety gap, with the plug wire ends well insulated from ground, would indicate the magneto is still strong enough to do it's job so to really find out the max energy potential of the mag unit, you would have to open the safety gap beyond the factory spec, in small increments, until the mag stopped firing that gap

when doing this, you would want to be careful to keep the number of "no gap jumping" cycles to a minimum to prevent breaking down the internal insulation of the coil..... two or three times in rapid succession shouldn't hurt a thing

so the above is just some rhetoric on testing your magneto's maximum potential but will hopefully help you in understanding what seeing the magneto jumping two 20 thou gaps in open air means, as opposed to seeing it jump a much larger sum of gaps which would simulate what is happening once compression pressure is factored into the process

the reason that fouled plugs don't always respond to even a very decisive bead blasting seems to be more related to formulation of today's pump fuels which has many more additives than it used to

it would seem that the additives can sometimes leave a nearly impossible to remove "glazing" on the business end of the plug which creates an electrical short inside the chamber allowing the compression pressure's resulting increased demand on the plug to have the same result as the "cleaned" plug still being fouled

this is something I've personally only seen with soaking wet (gas) fouled plugs and not slightly rich plugs having black fluffy build up or shiny black indicating excess oil in the chamber

iridium plugs are far more resistant to this type of "terminal or DOA" fouling, and fouling in general

to the best of my knowledge, today's fuels and this type of fouling are the reasons they were developed

oh, for best results, make sure you have fresh fuel and also clear the chambers of the very fuel that fouled your plugs before trying again

several kicks (fuel off) with the plugs removed should do it and compressed air thru a blow gun isn't a bad idea as well

good luck and if any of this isn't clear, I'll be glad to stab at it again

[Allan.Atherton]

... vented the cylinders with many kicks while fuel cock closed. Unfortunately with no result.That is still not the drill for flooding. Kicking with petcock closed will provide more fuel from the carbs and continue the flooding. You must kick with the throttle wide open to introduce air to clear out the fuel inside the combustion chamber.

[EuroIron]

I am puzzled as to the logic which leads me to deduce you are of the belief the fuel tap or petcock should in fact be left open during the WOT clear out kicks

perhaps I am reading this wrong or am ignorant to a fuel delivery condition that hasn't been a problem for me, thus far

[EuroIron]

to be more direct, did you mean "kicking with the throttle closed" or do you really mean to imply that the act of shutting off the fuel at the fuel tap will actually result in more fuel to foul said plugs?

what has worked for me has been to shut off the fuel tap and kick with throttle wide open


... vented the cylinders with many kicks while fuel cock closed. Unfortunately with no result.That is still not the drill for flooding. Kicking with petcock closed will provide more fuel from the carbs and continue the flooding. You must kick with the throttle wide open to introduce air to clear out the fuel inside the combustion chamber.

[VBMWMO]

Hello everybody. First, I wish you all a happy new year.
I have a problem with my R51/3 and will be grateful for any idea of what to try or do: After standing still for 1 year, I started the bike with 2nd kick (!). I rode it for 2 days, last one was yesterday. Every time it started without hesitating. Today morning, I tried to start the engine and it won't. There are fat sparks on each plug and fuel is reaching the carbs. As far as I know, the ignition is automatically and I also checked valve clearance. Where can the problem be? Any ideas what to look for?
Thanks a lot! Micha.