If you like our site, please consider joining our club!
By joining you will help ensure that we can continue to provide this service
JOIN HERE!

R69S battery

sherman980
Posts: 149
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:00 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 9 times

Re: R69S battery

Post by sherman980 »

Kurt,
Beware of the online fiches. Hard to know specifically what updates they include from over the years. Original dated literature gives you a better reference. I have a 1958 dated Repair manual that clearly shows the small battery in the repair illustration pics. I have an original 1961 Parts manual dated August 1961 that shows the small battery (6v 8amp) and tray for all models R50-R69S, tray part number is 8042212 (early post-war parts numbering system). I have an original 1966 parts book that shows an exploded diagram dated 1.4.1966 (may be European dating meaning April 1?) with the small battery and tray. It is listed for all models R50-R69S. I also have an NOS tray in my hands with the dealer tag still on it, part number 61218042212 (later parts numbering system). Moving forward, I have a 1968 original Parts book that has two exploded diagrams, both dated 1.5.70 (assuming these are updated pages that the dealer put in later as they were sent out from BMW). One of these diagrams shows the small battery and tray for all models and the other shows the large battery (6v 16amp) and tray for models R50-2 USA, R60-2 USA and R69-2 USA, but that diagram is specifically titled "USA" and the part number for the larger tray is 61218042213. Last, my reasonably original 1955 R69 has the small battery tray. So.... I can't pin down a specific date for the change from any of the above, but I can surely say that the "early" earls fork bikes used the small battery and later "USA" bikes used the large one....

Not sure that helps, but open to more info on the subject.

Thanks.
Chuck S.
Thanks.
Chuck S

User avatar
schrader7032
Posts: 9017
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 29 times

Re: R69S battery

Post by schrader7032 »

I guess when you get right down to it, does it really matter? Clearly if someone has an original bike (as much as they know) and it has a style of battery tray for the small or the big one, then I guess you know, right? And for the magneto system, the battery is there principally to provide a reserve for the lights when the engine is at idle. So would a small or larger battery work just as well? Maybe a smaller battery wouldn't have the brightness or last as long if it was needed.
Kurt in S.A.
'78 R100/7 '69 R69S '52 R25/2
Fast. Neat. Average. Friendly. Good. Good.

sherman980
Posts: 149
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:00 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 9 times

Re: R69S battery

Post by sherman980 »

Kurt,
I agree, it only maters if you care, and that's a personal choice. That said, caring or not should not be used as an excuse to set aside historical fact. In the "restoration" world, there are those who strive for "perfection" - how it came from the factory, and that requires a bit more effort than just wanting a bike to run and ride. Several decades ago, I gave up my interest in restoring old Corvettes when a friend's car got docked points at an NCRS (Corvette Restoration Society) judging event because the edges of the head gaskets weren't painted red like the rest of the engine he had hand assembled (and painted each piece separately). The factory just put the whole engine together and painted the whole assembly at once. Too anal for me at the time! Fast forward, now having been a judge at AMCA, Quail and other MC events over those decades, and having had to decide between two or more "nearly perfect" restorations, I've come to the conclusion that details mater, again, assuming you care. And if details do mater to you, it's important to get the facts right. My comments above were only meant to preserve historical fact. They were in no way meant to be critical of the decision about what battery the OP should use or not. Hope my clarification is helpful.

And if anyone has more original literature documentation on when the battery size changed, I'd be interested to know :) Still have a little room to waste upstairs for BMW trivia... LOL!

Thanks.
Chuck S.
Thanks.
Chuck S

User avatar
schrader7032
Posts: 9017
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 29 times

Re: R69S battery

Post by schrader7032 »

I hope people don't confuse me for leaning towards the concours-restoration side of things! That's not me. I care, but not like that! :D
Kurt in S.A.
'78 R100/7 '69 R69S '52 R25/2
Fast. Neat. Average. Friendly. Good. Good.

sherman980
Posts: 149
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:00 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 9 times

Re: R69S battery

Post by sherman980 »

NO worries, you wouldn't be here if you didn't have the same disease as everyone else here! The only question is how seriously you are infected! :lol:

Ride safe!
Thanks.
Chuck S

User avatar
schrader7032
Posts: 9017
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 29 times

Re: R69S battery

Post by schrader7032 »

Ha! I looked through Ian Falloon's book. I know nothing official, but both he and Roland were given access to some info from BMW as I understand. Anyway, Ian shows an R68 with a small better tucked down on the left side by the kicker. Then in the text for the 1955-1960 bikes he mentions the "weak" 8Ah battery. Nothing about the battery is mentioned for the 1961-on bikes other than to say that the pre 1961 Noris generator at 60 watts was changed to a Bosch system from 1961. It doesn't say what the output was but might it be sufficient to say that with the healthier generator in 1961 they might have gone to a larger battery?
Kurt in S.A.
'78 R100/7 '69 R69S '52 R25/2
Fast. Neat. Average. Friendly. Good. Good.

User avatar
Flx48
Posts: 259
Joined: Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:11 pm
Location: NW CT
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: R69S battery

Post by Flx48 »

Right Kurt-
At least some of the early Earles bikes had the square battery, while later all had the larger rectangular battery.
My '56 R69 came with the square while my '60 R69 came with the larger rectangular.
My old paper parts book (titled R50-R69s) lists both sizes of battery tray and rubber cushions, so max probably does, too.
Best-
George.

User avatar
jwonder
Posts: 784
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2016 7:50 pm
Location: Long Island, New York
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 7 times
Contact:

Re: R69S battery

Post by jwonder »

Well, shucks!!!

I am in the process of restoring my 1962 R 50 S and in the pile of parts I got with the motorcycle, it had the small tray.
Soooooooo, I didn't think twice and got a small battery, etc etc.

Being that I am completely CRAZY about my restorations and want every washer to be correct, this thread made me worry.

I looked into the BMW archives and I found the attached picture, and after measuring the air cleaner it seems as if this picture is showing the smaller battery, at least on the 1961 model. Look at the width of the air cleaner intake compared to the width of the battery. I do not believe that is a wider battery in that picture.

BUT!!! If you look at the pictures of the R 50 S that recently sold on BAT it shows a wide battery.....

Hmmmmmmmmm. Since everything else that came "in the box" was accurate and seemed original to my R 50 S, I think I am staying with the smaller battery until I find out otherwise.
Attachments
rightside.jpg
James Wonder
Vice President, Vintage BMW Motorcycle Owners
2022 BMW Friend Of the Marque
Long Island, New York

User avatar
schrader7032
Posts: 9017
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 29 times

Re: R69S battery

Post by schrader7032 »

It seems that the deep dimension stayed about the same but just got wider for the bigger battery. So I wouldn't think the clearance with the air cleaner would come into play between small and large batteries.
Kurt in S.A.
'78 R100/7 '69 R69S '52 R25/2
Fast. Neat. Average. Friendly. Good. Good.

User avatar
jwonder
Posts: 784
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2016 7:50 pm
Location: Long Island, New York
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 7 times
Contact:

Re: R69S battery

Post by jwonder »

Kurt,

I was looking at the width of the air intake and how it seems to be wider than the battery itself. The width of the R 50/69 S air intakes are quite wide, but the wide battery is equal or wider than the intake.

So, look at the side-to-side length, not how close it is to the battery (fore and aft).

It is not easy to tell and maybe I just want it to be true so I don't need to buy a whole new setup! :D :(
James Wonder
Vice President, Vintage BMW Motorcycle Owners
2022 BMW Friend Of the Marque
Long Island, New York

Post Reply