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bstratton
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Completely different subject - Horn

I disassembled my horn in order to clean and re-paint it. I have never heard it work.

Now I can't seem to get the damn thing to make horn noises.

I am reasonably confident that I assembled it correctly. I also believe I understand the theory of operation. voltage is applied - polarity is not important - and the electromagnet in the horn pulls the diaphragm and attached post down, which hits the contact and opens the circuit allowing the diaphragm to retract back up, closing the circuit and the process continues. Simple enough. The adjuster screw moves the contact assembly toward or away from the diaphragm and post. I did clean the contact and verified continuity.

When I apply voltage it obviously gets to the electromagnet but that's it. The circuit doesn't seem to ever open. I believe that backing off the adjuster screw moves the contact assembly toward the post, which would allow it to open the contact when the diaphragm is pulled down by the magnet but I can't seem to back it off enough. The magnet obviously energizes every time I apply power but never seems to de-energize.

I have read that the paper gasket is a necessary component. Mine is gone. Do I need to find or make a paper gasket to get this thing working?
It seems counter intuitive that moving the diaphragm and post farther away from the contact would help.

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Bstratton
1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

bstratton
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Maybe found the cause of right side noise

Got the right top end and cylinder off along with piston. The wrist pin bushing is loose in the connecting rod. Slid right out. My understanding from reading the Barrington manual is that the bushing should be very snug in the connecting rod - not able to be pushed out with your thumb.

Not even going to try to figure out how I missed that when I had the motor torn down. Now I want to look at the left side.

So it looks like - whether or not this was the cause of my noisy right cylinder - I need to replace at least one wrist pin bushing. I would like to avoid tearing the motor down again. Has anyone here attempted this procedure with the crank in the motor. Apparently cycle works has a tool (of course). It looks like the bushing needs to be pressed into the connecting rod then reamed to fit the wrist pin and the oil hole drilled. I'll need an adjustable reamer. Not sure if I will end up spending more on parts or tools....

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Bstratton
1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

312Icarus
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Keep playing with it. Make

Keep playing with it. Make sure all the contact points are clean and that it is put back together in the proper orientation. It is easiest to test in on the bench using a 6 volt battery charger as a power supply.

Icarus

PS Good luck with the wrist pin issue

bstratton
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wrist pin bushing replacement

Has anyone here attempted to do this without tearing down the motor and removing the crank.

Dan Neiner I believe has a tool that can facilitate pressing in the new wrist pin. Duane Ausherman has a discussion about this on his web site. Says the only way to ream the bushing correctly is to do it with the crank installed in the motor. Doing it that way enables the hole to be reamed exactly parallel to the crank journal. Says there is a way to somehow support the reamer with some sort of support that bolts to the motor case. I will reach out to Duane but thought I'd see if anyone on this forum can add to the information I am trying to compile.

My first decision point is to make a go - no go decision on attempting this at all. I am eager to give it a go and willing to spend the $$ on the tools needed as I intend to look for more projects when I'm done with this (only my second restoration). That said, I do not want to cause harm in doing so. "First I shall cause no harm"

Any thoughts on this would be appreciated.

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1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

malmac
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Toowoomba, Australia
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a youtube video on reaming little end bushes

Here is a video where the crank is still in the bike. I dont think it is rocket science, just takes time and care not to overshoot the clearance.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WdlA1oqs6I

Mal

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mal - R69s
Toowoomba- Australia

Daves79x
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Check Continuity

Simple fix for most of these horns is checking for continuity between the two posts (where the two wires connect). My guess is you don't have it. Clean the points with contact cleaner and unwaxed paper. When you have continuity, the horn will work. Fine adjustments are with the screw you refer to.

Dave

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bstratton
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Horn

Thanks, Dave

I do have continuity. The horn clicks when I apply power but that is it. I don't believe the contacts ever break. I have backed off the adjuster as far as I dare, which moves the contacts closer to the post that is attached to the diaphragm.

I'm sure this is probably a simple fix. I just need to spend the time. I have bigger fish to fry right now.

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Bstratton
1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

bstratton
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Spoke to Dan Neiner

He is willing to lend me his personal tool for this as he has none in stock. What a nice guy! I am constantly grateful for being part of this community. From what he says there is a press to install the bushing, a ball to press through and "lock" the bushing in the small end and a lap tool to get the final fit accomplished. Makes sense.

So I have bushings and tools on the way. Perhaps this weekend I'll have a chance to get the motor back together and finally take a real test ride. I hope this resolves the clacking noise. Not sure where to go if not - piston-to-cylinder clearance - big end bearings... Can't get caught up in that. Fix the problems at hand and then worry about what comes next.

Another first time for me. This project has provided lots of first time experiences. I hope I don't look back some day and reflect on all the mistakes I made on this one. Not a lot of replies to this particular post subject. I wonder if there are many on here who have attempted this themselves.

I'll let you all know how it goes.

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Bstratton
1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

bstratton
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Wrist pin bushing

Got my new bushings yesterday. They are almost twice as long as the original bushing. They seem to be the correct size as they look like they would just fill the conrod small end hole. I also noticed that the old bushing oil hole is right on the edge of the bushing.

This is surprising but maybe it shouldn't be. Is it possible that once the bushing became loose in the conrod it moved around and the edge(s) wore against the piston - thus shortening it?

I am now definitely going to pull the other cylinder and check the wrist pin bushing on that side more carefully.

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1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

wa1nca
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Ashfield Ma.
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Wrist Pin Bushing

Well I think you found your problem

The length of the new/old bushing should be the same as the width of the connecting rod and the oil hole should be in the middle of the bushing

Can you take a pic of both bushing

Tommy

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Tommy Byrnes
54 R51/3 55 R50 64 R27 68 R69US 68 Sears Allstate 250 (Puch)

bstratton
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pics

Still can't upload pics so here are some links
I noticed the edge of the old bushing near the oil hole is quite polished. I would surmise that is the end that wore against the piston more then the other side. I would also surmise this engine was run for quite a long time like this. You can see that what was left of the bushing was off center by the surface wear on the pin. That would be a good source of the noise. I cannot detect any uneven wear on the pin. I have a good Starrett vernier caliper coming so I can be more precise in my examination.

Left side will come off tomorrow.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1jirpIxTX46raBBImn_C9sq4BZWOTSM_c/view?u...
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bdgm_Y6Dhv-WtSGA7IKS5rp_HcRycnMJ/view?u...
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1asOBkCRMs0Khj1VeJFv2pjr5g0GbPJ_w/view?u...

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1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

wa1nca
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Ashfield Ma.
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Wrist Pin Bushing

Never have seen one wear like that
Glade you took it apart now

Looks like rist pin has wear also
your mic should indicate overall wear from side to side

cheap enough to also renew rist pin
Should be able to do repair and another test ride sets in before the snow comes

Ps
Yea I still cant upload any pics after new server was updated
I only have DSL as my super high speed internet and now think it is to slow for the new server and software

Tommy

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54 R51/3 55 R50 64 R27 68 R69US 68 Sears Allstate 250 (Puch)

bstratton
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Success

Wrist pin bushing was the cause of the noise. Motor is smooth and quiet.

The tool Dan lent me and the lapping tool are very effective. Worked great. It was pretty easy to get a perfect fit. Need to check the other side while I have the tool. Silly not to.

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1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

Daves79x
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Excellent!

Excellent! So glad you got it fixed - such a satisfying feeling.

Dave

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bstratton
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This project is complete!

The bike is running great. Looks very nice. It is registered and inspected (I got the horn working) and has 35 miles on it. I had to explain to the inspector that the hand brake does not activate the break light. I have not fine-tuned the carbs yet, which may explain the hot start difficulty. I will now go through the whole bike and be sure all the bolts are tight and re-torque the head bolts - readjust the valves. I see no indication of any seals leaking. I have a little gas seeping from the left carb but that is all I could find. I'll tighten things up there. Got the tank lid, new lock and side stand on. BTW I saw someone on another thread mention that the BMW stock side stand is not self-retracting. The new ones are. There is a little nub on the end of the pivot bolt which catches the spring-end washer and pushes it out. The side stand will not detent down so when you take the weight off it it snaps back up. Nice little design improvement.

Those 35 miles were the nicest ever! It was a beautiful fall day and the bike ran flawlessly. Such a comfortable and quiet ride compared to the slash5. Plenty of power, too. I was a little concerned about that. The charging system works very well, the stock lights are nice and bright. I may not bother with the LED replacements yet. I always ride with the headlight on but rarely at night. Once the voltage regulator kicks in the generator light goes out and stays out even at idle.

I will post a link to a few pics and call this done. Thank you all for your advice, information and encouragement. This was my second restoration and by far the most comprehensive. I have used up all my available space with these two bikes now so I have a detatched garage under construction. It will be nice to have a real shop and some space that isn't my basement. Once that is complete I will likely be looking for another project. Maybe another BMW - maybe something else. Whatever comes my way.

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1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

wa1nca
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Ashfield Ma.
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Leaking gas left side

If your using the side stand it is common that the left side will leak a little after being parked
Will make it hard to start after parking even for a gas fill up

Should always shut off the gas at least 500 feet before parking the bike
This will lower the fuel level so when parked on the side stand it will not leak

Glad you got it running before the cold & snow comes
Looking forward to see some pics

If you ever come out to western Ma let me know
I live in Ashfield about 30 miles from Mount Greylock
Great roads here and in Vermont

Tommy

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Tommy Byrnes
54 R51/3 55 R50 64 R27 68 R69US 68 Sears Allstate 250 (Puch)

bstratton
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I know where Ashfield is...

I know where Ashfield is... God's country out there.

I am in Walpole. I have a friend in Hudson who has a 56' R69. Its a survivor and well cared for. He is my riding buddy. Perhaps some day I will convince him to join me on a ride to Ashfield. I bet there is a brewery or two in that neck of the woods where we could stop for lunch.

I am sure we'll get another few opportunities for a nice ride before winters teeth start to show. It'll give me a little time to get the slash5 squared away so my horses are all healthy and roadworthy.ll get a few pics posted probably this weekend weather permitting.

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1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

Wayne J in MA
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Westwood
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Walpole

I am in Westwood, right next door, and ride with friends in Barre (R60/2) and Bellingham (R50/2). We usually ride in the Quabbin area and west then up into S. Vermont. In the process of slowly rebuilding a R69S.

Wayne

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'62 R69S, '71 R75/5 SWB, '78 R100S Motorsport

wa1nca
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Ashfield Ma.
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Vintage Mass BMW Rides

Quabbin area and west then up into S. Vermont

Im up for this one

Time to get our bikes ready for next season

Tommy

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Tommy Byrnes
54 R51/3 55 R50 64 R27 68 R69US 68 Sears Allstate 250 (Puch)

bstratton
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sounds like we got us a convoy!

Lets stay in touch. Im sure my buddy would be up for that, too.

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1971 R60/5
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MA

Daves79x
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Congrats!

Congrats! Sounds like you pretty much have it. Now just enjoy how great a bike it is to ride.

Dave

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bstratton
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tools

Wayne,

I have a lot of the special tools needed to rebuild your bike. Don't hesitate to ask if you need anything.

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Bstratton
1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

bstratton
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pic

Here is just one pic. The weather has been so bad I haven't been able to get her out in the sun for a nice photo shoot.
No matter what I do I can't post pics to this site any more so please just click the link to my google drive.
I used to be able to so there are some "before" pics in the beginning of the thread.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1az-YDZ5DQwSXnbGLjVBYDax06oaPYBYE

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Bstratton
1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

Beemer100
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Germany
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what a beauty.

what a beauty. Congrats.

Guess you have the carbs somewhere in your workshop ... just kidding
Klaus

bstratton
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HA!

No wonder it was so hard to start!

Obviously need a later pic - maybe this weekend if the weather cooperates. Cant get a decent pic in the basement shop. Too crowded

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1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

hooverbj
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I'https://www.ebay.com/itm/NE

I'https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-BMW-R60-2-R50-2-R60-R50-CYLINDER-HEAD-SPECIAL-ORDER-SEE-DESCRIPTION/263895147918 Im wondering about this guy $850. seems like a fair price, if in fact they are brand new.

bstratton
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Yes. Almost too good to be

Yes. Almost too good to be true. I am sceptical. I bought a used head from the same seller in hopes that I could use it to replace the head I damaged taking off the exhaust pipe. The head he sold me had been machined to the point of no return. Useless.

Good price if real, though.

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Bstratton
1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

wa1nca
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Ashfield Ma.
Joined: 09/27/2012
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Heads
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Tommy Byrnes
54 R51/3 55 R50 64 R27 68 R69US 68 Sears Allstate 250 (Puch)

bstratton
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Running Pics

Just 2 but at least it is outdoors. 40 degrees today. Bike ran great. 60 miles on the re-build.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1TP9z8piSNhaw5WzCEX-OQEnQBXvF6G8Q
https://drive.google.com/open?id=16V0mLsY06zcDfUkcTiYfZdqVlhlt3kM9

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Bstratton
1971 R60/5
1965 R50/2
MA

wa1nca
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VBMWMO #8374
Ashfield Ma.
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Your Bike

Very nice
Too bad riding season is almost over

Hope to see it this spring/summer !!

Tommy

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Tommy Byrnes
54 R51/3 55 R50 64 R27 68 R69US 68 Sears Allstate 250 (Puch)

Wayne J in MA
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Westwood
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Your bike

BStratton

Your bike looks really nice and I enjoyed this thread immensely

Thank you for the offer of the special tools. I think I am okay. I have the Many-in-One set and a few others.

Wayne

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'62 R69S, '71 R75/5 SWB, '78 R100S Motorsport

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