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dBDawg
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VBMWMO #8575
Joined: 01/18/2013
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I'm trying to figure out what's really suppose to lock the timing gear in place on my cam shaft. There was a half hearted improvised keyway cut into the shaft and old gear as seen in the pictures. However, the new gear has no keyway which doesn't surprise me. I already had the cam refurbished forgetting about this issue. Now I feel a little stuck and cautious on how to precede. Any input would be great. Thanks

  • bmw_r11-_cam_shaft_-_8.jpg
  • bmw_r11-_cam_shaft_-_11.jpg
Darryl.Richman
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Cam timing

It appears that your R11 is a later model, maybe Serie IV or V? On the Serie I motors, and the preceding generation of bikes (R52-R63), the breather is on the end of the crankshaft. But the cam gear was locked into place at the factory by pushing the gear onto the shaft and then boring a small hole in the seam between the gear and shaft and pressing in a small pin. It looks like it was done the same way in your motor.

Here are a couple photos of an R63 camshaft, which may help you with pinning the gear in place and also getting the timing right. The first shows the front of the cam gear and you can see the top of the pin holding the gear and shaft in position. You can also see that two adjacent teeth are marked; when you assemble the case halves, the crankshaft should be set at TDC and these two teeth should surround a tooth on the idler gear (zwischenzahnrad), to get the timing right.

If your cam gear is not marked, you can find the two teeth by looking at the front most cam lobe. The peak of the lobe should be between two teeth on the gear (marked in red in the 2nd photo), and those marked teeth are 180 degrees across the cam gear from the teeth that should capture the idler gear tooth.

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dBDawg
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Wow, thanks, Darryl. So much

Wow, thanks, Darryl. So much great information. I appreciate it.

So to clarify your last sentence on setting the timing, The peak of the front cam lobe will be pointing away from the idle gear (180) when captured and the crank is at TDC?

Darryl.Richman
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Yes, that's right. I'm

Yes, that's right.

I'm attaching the engine timing diagram for the R11 out of the reproduction handbook I have. At the bottom you can see how the cam gear is timed, at the top, how the valves and magneto are timed. Where it says Hub - 78mm, that represents the stroke of the piston. The points marked along there represent where different things happen, relative to TDC or BDC.

The lines that go off to the right show how those linear timings relate to the cam rotation. Auslaßperiode is the time the exhaust valve is open, Einlaßperiode is the intake timing. These are for the right hand cylinder (number 1).

Glossary

Einlaß = intake
Auslaß = exhaust
Vorzündung = full spark advance
Öffnet = open
Schließt = closed
Oberer Totpunkt = TDC
Unterer Totpunkt = BDC
Hub = stroke
Steuerwelle = camshaft
Steuerwellenrad = cam gear
Zwischenrad = idler (intermediary) gear
Kurbelwelle = crankshaft
Kolben = piston

  • r11-timing.jpg
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dBDawg
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handbook

Darryl, is it still possible to get that handbook and where might I pick one up? I've never come across one and I didn't know it was out there.

Darryl.Richman
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Unfortunately, I've never

Unfortunately, I've never seen these kind of books available in the States. I've bought a bunch of them at swap meets like Veterama in Germany. They are photocopy reproductions of the originals - some are much better than others, just depends on what the producer started with an how much care they took. They tend to cost 20-25€, which adds up pretty quickly if you're buying a parts book and an owners manual for each model/generation.

So, I'm sure you could get a book like this, but you'll probably have to find it in Germany.

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Ian R11
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A downloadable R11/16

A downloadable R11/16 handbook in German is available from this site,

http://cms.bmw-einzylinder.de/index.php/literatur/bmw-handbuecher-und-er...

This particular version doesn't have the drawing Darryl shows, just the top part showing valve timing in relation to crank position. I have never seen that informative drawing before, and it's not in the R62 handbook I also have.

The later R11 cam gear has a key way and key sitting in the cam shaft.

dBDawg
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Darryl, I'm just getting

Darryl,

I'm just getting ready to set the timing gear on the cam shaft and had a couple more questions or observations.

1. The hole in the cam lobe is there to help with alignment I assume? see picture (forgive the lego shaft, haha I'm not in the shop - but looks like the old gear teeth where setup up between the lobe center)

2. How are the breather holes suppose to be orientated? TDC (pointing to the sides) is how they appear from my old setup when I place the old gear on the assembly.

Thanks again.

  • bmw_r11-_cam_shaft_-_13.jpg
  • bmw_r11-_cam_shaft_-_14.jpg
Ian R11
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I'm a bit confused with what

I'm a bit confused with what your showing. To me it appears you have an early cam and timing gear with a later model breather. This later version breather should have two dowels attaching it to the timing gear and therefor self timing. Any dowels? The later engine case is also different to allow this, it will have a breather hole in the casting from the cam cover to the crank "bung". The timing gear/breather cover holds the breather in place and is a different part to the early version.

Some photos of the cases and the timing gear cover could help identify what you have. The bit I'm not understanding so far is...... if an early engine case how could a breather on the cam work? and if a late engine casing how does your gear driven cam work? as the intermediate timing gear needed would not locate in the casing.

dBDawg
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Hey Ian. Here's a pic showing

Hey Ian. Here's a pic showing the top half of the case with the breather hole. I know the separate breather (run by mating dowels) you are talking about. I don't have a Series 5 engine which I understand it goes to. It's either a series 2,3,or 4 from what I can gather on the breather hole and parts book. I can't piece together from the parts book what the configuration for the series 1 engine is. It seems not to have a breather, if that is correct.

I don't have the cam cover, so no help there with the identification. If anyone know where I can get one that would be great. I had seen one on ebay classifieds but the who ever is seller it didn't respond.

As always, Thanks for all the help you guys give....

  • bmw_engine_case17.jpg
Ian R11
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VBMWMO #8148
Yorkshire uk
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Your photo and a check in the

Your photo and a check in the parts book erases my confusion. Wrongly I assumed all the gear driven cam engines would breath from the crank like series 1. I can't help with the part needed M56 113a, if you have not already done so, try Torsten Tausch or Oldtimer Garage. Likewise I can't help with how the breather attaches as I have no experience on series 2/4. The parts book also shows a pin for locating the gear as Darryl describes earlier. The polyamide intermediate gear is also worth fitting as in earlier photo, much quieter running.

Luigi bmwR68
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BMW R11 manuals

Hello
I've some original manual R11/R16 , (Handbuck , Partslist ..) if you want to know some detail parts I cand send you some pictures...
sorry but i don't speak english very well...
Regards
Luigi

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Darryl.Richman
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Sorry about my absence...

...I've been away for 8 weeks and then my computer was dead when I got home. I've got a few more excuses, if you need them. Wink

dBDawg, I've never seen a cam with a hole in the lobe, like that. Is this a reproduction?

Also, I've never had my hands inside a Serie II-IV motor, so I only know what I can see in the parts book and owners manual.

That said, I would try to line up the breather output - that oblong hole on the front of the breather - so that the trailing edge is just closing up the breather hole in the case, right after BDC. That should have the breather opening up as the pistons descend (where they would create overpressure in the case if there were no breather), and being closed while the pistons ascend, creating a partial vacuum in the case (one of the secrets why BMW got such a sterling reputation for not leaking).

Unfortunately, I don't have a motor apart right now to see what BMW did, exactly.

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